LPG Gas Suppliers

Link:  BP to Sell LPG

It will be interesting to see who buys this, could be any of the bigger suppliers but my bet would be Flogas.

Regards – Dickie

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Besides my great site!! I was on the  “Money Saving Expert” website checking out LPG and there is some useful information there (link on my web page address site and at the bottom of this post).

I was inquiring about 3.5ppl cut clauses from contracts and finding more information about the E-petition scheme. Looks like my totals (4 million was including all non mains users….oops!) Below is the reply i received which was very useful:

quote:

It varies from supplier-to-supplier, and also from contract-to-contract with a given supplier. For example, Calor in recent times have offered contracts with “get out” clauses set at rates of 3ppl every six months, 3.5ppl every six months and even 3.5ppl every three months, so you’ll need to check your contract carefully.

Also, not all suppliers include any such clause at present, Flogas being a notable and probably the most significant example. Previous Flogas contracts have been criticised by the OFT for failing to include such a clause, and this is an area that the OFT are (supposedly) looking to tighten up on. There has been a lot of discussion on these points in this thread over the past year to 18 months, so if you read back a few pages, I’m sure all your questions on this matter will be answered.

Quote:

Nice idea. I am one of the eight who have already signed, so only another 99,992 to go! The problem is finding 100,000 users to sign it. I am going from memory here, but the figure of 4 million is the total number of Off Mains energy users in the UK. The majority of these use heating oil, with a small number using wood stoves or renewables. The number of domestic LPG users in the UK is closer to the 270,000 mark, of whom a signifiant proportion use bottled LPG. I seem to remember that the total number of bulk LPG users was recently quoted as being closer to 150,000, which in the grand scheme of things is a pretty minority voice.

Anyway, no harm to be had in signing – and for those who wish to, the petition can be found here: http://epetitions.direct.gov.uk/petitions/14598

As for moving LPG regulation further up the agenda, the recent OFT study into Off Mains Energy Supply did LPG users no favours at all (plenty on that subject posted in this thread too!); And persistent letter writing to MPs, the OFT and the Secretary of State seems to have no more significant affect than banging your head repeatedly against a (very thick) brick wall, partly because LPG users are such a small minority and partly because of political reluctance to do anything that would discourage any movement away from any non-renewable energy source. I really would like to see this moved up the political agenda but I’m really not entirely sure how this can be done.

Make no mistake, there are a few good and honest guys out there, (i.e. some of the smaller independent suppliers), but the domestic LPG supply industry is self-regulated (via UKLPG) and by-and-large appears to me and to many other users to be dangerously out of control. Despite the Competition Commission Order of 2009 competition simply does not work effectively in this market, indeed, some would even argue that the CC Orders have, in hindsight, served to reduce competition and increase prices! (Incidentally, in respect of pricing, I have also heard some pretty convincing arguments that for many lower-consumption bulk users, moving to 47kg cylinder supply could also work out significantly cheaper than continuing with bulk supply in the medium to long term).

I fear that the bottom line is that, like it or not, every LPG user probably has to accept the the LPG market is likely to stay pretty much as it is for the foreseeable future. So we have to take responsibility to educate ourselves, to understand our contracts, to ensure that we don’t get taken for a ride over price increases, to insulate our homes like it’s going out of fashion, and prepare to move to micro generation and/or renewable heat sources as soon as practically and economically viable (i.e. when your LPG boiler reaches the end of its life, of not sooner). And look on the bright side – Calor, Flogas et. al. aren’t going to look quite so smug or smart when nobody is buying their LPG anymore.

………….All good stuff I think you’d agree! – Regards Dickie

http://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/forumdisplay.php?f=78

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Today I received a call from Countrywide after I had sent in a letter of complaint about the price rise of 3.5 ppl.

The chap I spoke to was to be honest sympathetic and agreed that issuing a price rise at the current time and climate was not the best decision Countrywide had ever made. The likes of Calor and Flogas had all issued price rises back before Christmas and Countrywide had decided to hold to see how the market played out.

He said that should customers wish to call they were always prepared to negotiate ( he had received numerous calls today).

So my advice is to ring/ write and tell them how you feel and see what you can get.

He further went on to say that the major energy companies (British Gas, EDF etc) drop in prices was on average 5% but to remember that their increase was approximately 15% so they still had gained a healthy 10%.

Gas at the moment was proving difficult to move, (we haven’t had a winter like last year), so there is a surplus, whether this means there may be a drop in the price later in the year is anybody’s  guess, we will have to wait and see, but personally I wouldn’t hold your breath.

Don’t forget to sign the petition (details in the previous post)

Regards – Dickie

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After checking the Blog and reading various comments I was having a think last night about anyway we could start putting pressure on the LPG suppliers. At the moment the way I see it is that we the customers are certainly not in the driving seat, the Suppliers determine the price, rent and delivery of all things LPG. Surely this should be the other way round, we the customer should be able to have some say in setting rules and regulations especially when it comes to prices?

How can we start putting pressure on the suppliers? Well one way would be to start an E-petition Scheme, this is where a petition of 100,000 signatures is raised which then means your petition is elegible for debate in the House of Commons.

So I took a look on the government website and lo and beyold there is a petition:- http://epetitions.direct.gov.uk/search?q=LPG

The problem is that it hasn’t got a lot of signatures! Probably because the word has not been spread about, so lets get in there and start signing up!

Two things could come out of this, a large amount of press coverage (which no supplier would enjoy especially if negative) and also the possiblility of getting either a cap placed on LPG prices or the introduction of a regulator. Either way it would be a positive move for the 4 million customers who have LPG supplied to them.

Spread the word and lets start Signing!

Best regards – Dickie

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I seem to have woken up today in a dream world!

While all the major energy suppliers are reducing their prices (see previous post), one LPG supplier seems to have a different idea.

I received a letter today from Countrywide informing me; “Prolonged economic uncertainty and the Euro region crisis combined to have an effect on the price of LPG. After a period of relative stability the propane market has turned adversely in the last month or so, and we are faced with an immediate price increase. Your individual increase will be 3.5p per litre.”

Has anybody else received price increases from their suppliers?

Countrywide cannot be the only supplier to do this as they normally hunt in packs!

I will be trying to find out further details from Countrywide as to why they have decided to do this. In the meantime please let me know if you have received a letter from your supplier.

Regards

( A very disappointed) Dickie

A further update:

I have written to Countrywide asking for further details as to why they have raised their prices, I will let you know the outcome as soon as I have a reply.

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So we hear British Gas have followed EDF Energies lead in dropping their prices by 5% with emmediate effect. Whilst SSE will reduce their tarrifs by 3.8% from March the 26th.

This is great news because it will put pressure on the LPG suppliers to drop their prices. As an added incentive when negotiating you new contracts or haggling for prices make sure you let slip about Britsh Gas and others dropping their prices and what is your supplier going to do about it?

It’s even worth just giving your supplier a call to ask them if they are following British Gases lead! Lets put pressure on them.

Regards – Dickie

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Well the time has come for my tank to be refilled. I took a look today to see how much gas I had left and it was less than 5%. Interestingly I received a letter from Countrywide telling me to check my tank so that if necessary I can order gas before ( heaven forbid) the bad weather is once again upon us!

So this morning I rang Countrywide and informed them my tank was down to 5% and I required a refill, “what was the current unit price” I asked, a pause and then “54.6 ppl sir”. After getting off the floor I asked the young lady to repeat just in case my hearing was playing up, no definitely 54.6 ppl.

So the negotiations begin “can we do better than that price wise?” another pause, “well Sir, I don’t actually deal with prices”. So I asked if she would get someone to ring me to discuss the price- I should get a call early next week, I will keep you all posted.

WISH ME LUCK.

Best Regards – Dickie

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I have received a worrying email from one of our readers: -

Pat writes: “Went round all the village and got 22 people with Flogas who were interested in forming a syndicate. Telephoned Flogas and was told they do not negotiate with groups/syndicates now only individuals. Has anybody else had this problem?”

I would like to chase this up with Flogas and find out what is going on, so have any other syndicates had similar problems with any supplier, but in particular Flogas?  I think it’s time to remind Flogas of the BBC programme “don’t get done get Dom” and if necessary contact Dominic Littlewood to  see what he has to say. I Look forward to hearing from you.

I’d also like to thank Stephen Thomas for writing in;

Stephen writes: I’ve today received a reply from the Dept of Energy & Climate Change (DECC)in response to my contacting the Energy Secretary.

The OFT is due to report later this month (October 2011) into a study it launched in January 2011 to investigate the issues affecting those who are not on the gas-grid; exploring the longer term consumer issues such as lifetime payback, consumer standards and labelling for alternative energy sources or supplies.
The study promises to provide an independent assessment of the off-grid market and establish what further action may be necessary to ensure it works properly.
Website for further details: http://www.oft.gov.uk/shared_oft/market-studies/oft1302f.pdf.

Hopefully this report which we have been waiting for, will give us some of the results that we have been seeking. Provided I have the necessary permissions I will publish the parts of the report that concerns LPG as soon as I am able.

Best regards – Dickie

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So the Energy Secretary Mr Huhne is going to “get tough” over energy prices, well let’s hope that includes LPG.

I will be writing to the Energy Secretary confirming that LPG is including in his plans, I urge you all to do the same. There are approximately 3.5 million of us who use LPG, with the majority of us all paying different tariffs, absolutely ridiculous isn’t it?  

With the real possibility of a further recession, we the consumer are being taken for a ride by these suppliers. Therefore I urge you to write/email to confirm we are included in this “Get Tough” campaign.

Department of Energy & Climate Change
3 Whitehall Place
London
SW1A 2AW 

Tel: 0300 060 4000 (standard national rate)

Email: correspondence@decc.gsi.gov.uk

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It’s obvious to me as I read through the posts that readers are queuing up looking for syndicates all over the UK, whether they are having success I just don’t know. So to help all our followers if you know of a syndicate please tell us. This way the information can be passed on and in the end the bigger the syndicate the more clout you have when it comes to prices. So please send us any information with regard to operating syndicates and more importantly how you are getting on with negotiating a price with the selected LPG supplier. It would be nice if we could produce a syndicate list so that readers could easily locate one within their area. I’ve decided to set up a separate page so that people can advertise their existing syndicate or an interest in forming one so that people can increase numbers in syndicates and give themselves increased negotiating power. Hopefully this will be set up in the next few days.

I see once again Flogas is in the process of notifying customers of their new winter prices, please let us know details so that everyone is aware of what to expect and how hopefully we can provide advice to those who have a ridiculous price increase.

Now is the time most customer will receive a letter from their suppliers informing them of price increases. The more we know about this the more we can compare and argue our case for fairer prices across the board.

I look forward to hearing your comments.

Best Regards

Dickie

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